Web Exclusive: A conversation with the Hold Steady's Franz Nicolay
Maybe you’re one of the many who recognize that the Hold Steady’s songs are
sing-along songs. Maybe you’re one of the few holding a precious, DIY copy of multi-instrumentalist Franz Nicolay‘s Black Rose Paladins. If you fall into the latter camp, you’re likely well aware that Nicolay recently released his proper debut full-length, Major General. The singer/songwriter found time despite his duties in the aforementioned Hold Steady along with the World/Inferno Friendship Society, Anti-Social Music, Guignol and the roughly 1,000 other projects Nicolay is working on, to lay down 13 tracks with several collaborators. Brian Shultz recently talked with Nicolay about the album’s direction, aesthetics and its very finite playlist.
For the most part on Major General, you seemed to eschew the stripped-down, acoustic singer/songwriter approach in favor of more ornate, elaborate instrumentation that you would find on a Hold Steady album. Is that basic style just not in your blood?
I love big, orchestral productions on rock records, as you can tell from the World/Inferno and Hold Steady albums. You don’t really get to recreate those in a live setting; your only chance to make those is in the studio setting. So I wanted to take advantage of that chance, and I knew that I would be touring solo, at least for the time being, [and doing] stripped-down versions. If people prefer those, they can see them live. [Laughs.] But I wanted my chance to do the sort of grandiose production.
Do you think you’ll ever get the chance to do the full instrumentation live?
Sure, yeah. Absolutely. I can do that. I did some shows with the band [who played on the album]–Yula Be’era [bass, of Nanuchka], Jared Scott [guitar, Demander] and Brian Viglione [drums, World/Inferno Friendship Society, Dresden Dolls], [so] it wouldn’t be too complicated. There weren’t really that many people involved–[World/Inferno saxophonist] Peter Hess did some horns, Emilyn Brodsky and Anthony da Costa did some background vocals and there were the string sections–so it would be pretty easy to get all those people involved. It just doesn’t always translate sonically the same way.
A few of these songs, like “Quiet Where I Lie,” don’t seem that far removed from the Hold Steady. Was making a distinction between the two important to you?
That’s funny you would say "Quiet Where I Lie," because that actually was a Hold Steady song. It was a B-side called “For Boston” from [2006’s] Boys And Girls In America. We played it live maybe once and there just didn’t seem to be that much interest in the song within the band. I just thought it had too good of a riff to let [go] so I decided to record my own version.
There’s obviously gonna be some crossover in the sound because I’m in the Hold Steady and I write some of the music.
Quiet Where I Lie – Franz Nicolay
Some people characterize your 2007 solo album Black Rose Paladins as a demo. Would you agree with that?
It wasn’t really a release, per se. It was literally the demos for Major General. I needed to record something to give to the other players, and I was playing solo shows and I wanted to have something to sell. So I went into the studio for a day and just banged out solo versions of all the songs and printed up 50 CD-Rs and hand-made covers for them. But it was really nothing more than the demos. There were two songs that didn’t end up on Major General and there were two songs on Major General that weren’t on the demos, so there’s a couple of extra tracks but I’m just keeping it as a digital thing now.
So as your first proper album, what were you trying to capture on Major General that you didn’t on Black Rose?
I knew that when I was going to do a record under my own name, that I wanted to work with Yula, Jared and Brian–that was sort of my dream team band. I knew we didn’t have much time to do it, so I wanted to capture the immediacy that happens when really talented musicians have just sort of wrapped their heads around the song and figured out the parts–but not so well that they’re totally comfortable with them yet. I think it gives a real energy [to the album].
If you were given the option of more time to record, would you take advantage of it?
I don’t think it needed any more time. I got what I needed.
What sort of aesthetic were you going for?
I was going for an intense, melodramatic, passionate singer/songwriter record. I’ve described it as Scott Walker singing the exit music to an MGM musical as backed by the Attractions. And I think I got something close to that. Some of the songs come from different eras. So in my mind, those are separate; but I don’t think it comes across that way on the record when you’re listening to it. I think, mostly, the songs just [have] the lyrical distinction–the newer songs are wordier.
You’ve described another project of yours, Guignol, as "music for occasions, dancing, bonfires, sweating and enjoyment." What would you consider Major General for?
[Laughs.] I would describe Major General for the one day a year you put on a tuxedo and go to a rock show.
On the first track, "Jeff Penalty," you seem to take a pretty neutral stance on the whole Jeff Penalty and the Dead Kennedys issue.
Oh, I don’t think it’s a neutral position at all. Obviously, it’s a true-life story of when World/Inferno opened for the Dead Kennedys. The whole experience was really interesting, because it was sort of an insight into some of the politics of punk and how they play out in real life. Obviously, when famous bands reunite without their iconic lead singers, they’re gonna come in for a certain amount of criticism. But in the event, when that show happens [and it’s] sold out with 3,000 people there, everyone was singing along to their favorite songs. The band sounded great and I thought, “How could I begrudge them wanting to continue to play together? They’ve always been a fantastic band. Or how could I [begrudge] Jeff Penalty the opportunity to sing what were probably some of his favorite songs growing up with a great band. “It was sort of, I guess, the triumph of joy over ideology.
Jeff Penalty (w/ Demander) – Franz Nicolay
So it was more you resolving the "punk judgments" you might’ve had towards the situation?
Yeah. I think that any music scene–any scene of any kind–has its rules and ethics and can be really judgmental, and certainly punk is no exception. But then sometimes the judgments and the ideology of punk get in the way of the purity of the feeling of listening to songs or making music. The other part of that was this idea of bands that have become so identified with their iconic frontmen that the rest of the band gets lost in the scheme [of things]–and the talent of that band and their contributions to the records [is lost]. It’s subsumed into this one personality. I think that’s kind of a shame.
I thought it was weird you placed that as the opening track, since it addresses a specific issue people are probably familiar with, whereas most of the other tracks are more personal narratives.
Well, I think making a track listing is kind of like writing a set list. You want to have a grabber. And also, that was the first track I recorded for the record, [though] in a different session. So, conceptually, it was the first time I had an idea of what the record might sound like.
Was this version the one you recorded with producer Don Fury?
It is, yeah.
How did you hook up with him?
He had done the last two World/Inferno records at his place in Coney Island, New York. It was a really good experience because he’s great to work with. He’s a real character. [Laughs.] He makes the record sound big, cheaply and quickly. He also doesn’t have a lot of tolerance for fooling around–or multiple takes. He’s one of those guys who [thinks] if you haven’t gotten it pretty much as a live take after one or two takes, there’s a little problem as far as he’s concerned. [Laughs.]
But he didn’t track the whole record?
No, he just tracked that one [song]. That was gonna be a separate release–a split 7-inch that never ended up materializing, so it ended up on [Major General]. I did the rest of the record with James Frazee at a place called Water Music in Hoboken, New Jersey. And then John Agnello mixed most of it.
Who else was gonna be on that split 7-inch?
Mischief Brew. But the label that was gonna put it out were sort of preoccupied with other things and it sat on the shelf for too long and eventually we just decided to forget about it. [Laughs.] But Erik [Petersen of Mischief Brew] and I have other projects that we’ve been working on. We just finished tracking a Guignol and Mischief Brew collaboration that should come out in a few months; that’ll be really cool.
Do you ever feel like you’re overworking yourself with all of the various projects you immerse yourself in?
It can get a little overwhelming, but I find the opposite is way worse: If I’m sitting at home with nothing to do, I go really crazy really quickly. Because I’m on the road so much, my apartment is kind of a glorified storage space. For two years it didn’t have windows, so I jumped at every opportunity to be out doing something rather than just sitting in the dark watching DVDs. [Laughs.]
Cease-Fire, or, Mrs. Norman Maine – Franz Nicolay
