In conversation with Scowl and Frank Iero

Scowl appear on the cover of the Fall 2023 Issue. Head to the AP Shop to grab a copy, as well as an exclusive vinyl variant of Psychic Dance Routine, limited to 100 copies.

“It’s a fickle thing to want to be identifiable yet feel strangled by the idea of being boxed into one singular identity,” says Kat Moss, the lime green-haired frontwoman of Santa Cruz hardcore outfit Scowl. It’s a heavy, honest sentiment she throws out, one felt by many hard-working artists in the industry, and certainly beyond. It’s this type of truism that we see, and hear, from Moss and her band that has allowed them to straddle being both a band’s band and an audience favorite since their start. In real time, Moss and her bandmates — Malachi Greene, Mikey Bifolco, Bailey Lupo, and Cole Gilbert — are making their way through Europe on tour, celebrating their anthemic third EP, Psychic Dance Routine, and sharing their defiantly charged sound and dedicated, expressive live performance with a world that every day is accepting hardcore further into their hearts.

Read more: 15 best modern hardcore bands for day one fans

Observing the wave that is heavy music and the hardcore scene crashing down on a wider audience than ever before, Scowl sit at its crest. Since the release of their first self-titled EP in 2019, the group have garnered attention and acclaim from those within the community and beyond, accruing fans like Post Malone and Travis Barker, alternative legends the band’s members grew up listening to and venerating themselves. In four short years, they’ve found themselves in a series of pinch-me moments — from a DM of admiration from Fred Durst that led to an opening slot touring with Limp Bizkit to a shoutout from Hayley Williams on her podcast Everything is Emo. For the band, and the Santa Cruz hardcore scene they came from, it’s been a whirlwind that’s all too easy to get swept up in. However, they’ve made sure to remember where they came from. 

For the cover story, Alternative Press followed the band around their beachfront hometown on the eve of the European leg of their tour. While on the road, eager to express their gratitude and reignite inspiration new and old while juggling time zones and exhaustion, Moss and Greene conversed with yet another Scowl fan-cum-alternative icon and personal hero — who also happened to be touring — Frank Iero, guitarist of supergroup L.S. Dunes and My Chemical Romance. 

First off, thanks for taking the time to answer these questions. I know this can be an exciting experience but also a bit soul-sucking at the same time. Also, I’m flattered to have been asked to do this with you. I will try my best to not waste your time or make you wish you never asked me.

KAT MOSS: Thanks for taking the time to come up with such thoughtful questions! We are so grateful, especially considering how challenging it is to find time to do this stuff when on tour, taking care of physical and mental health, and just being a human! 

In other interviews I’ve seen, I know most members of Scowl have been in other bands around the scene, but Kat, if I’m not mistaken, you said this is your first band. How did the connection between members come to be? Why did you feel this was the band? And what, if any, were your expectations when starting Scowl?

MOSS: Correct! Everyone had at least a few years of experience playing in DIY hardcore bands — except me! The only musical experience I previously had was high school choir. I met Malachi (guitar) and Cole (drums) around roughly the same time. They were playing in a band I love from Santa Cruz called Jawstruck. I had always wanted to be in a band. I just didn’t know how that reality would unfold. I was active in the Bay Area/Northern California hardcore scene for a little over a year, often going to shows alone. I actually met Malachi at a Gilman show in Berkeley! It didn’t take long for me to open up to Malachi and express my interest in playing in a band. I had zero expectations besides a few “bucket list” goals. This was my mindset:

• Play shows with our friends: Drain, Gulch, Sunami, Hands of God, Jawstruck, No Right, etc. 
• Maybe even open for some of my favorite hardcore bands like Gorilla Biscuits or Terror! 
• Tour as much as possible 
• Play my favorite hardcore fest, Sound and Fury! 
• Play a show at 924 Gilman
• I mean it when I say I truly had no idea what was in store for us when it came to our opportunities. 

Music is a beautiful and interesting vocation. It’s coveted by many and misunderstood by more. Some people who do it for a living never expected it to be their main job, and many who would do anything to be where we are will never get the shot they deserve or are hoping for. Was this something you always wanted to do with your lives? If not, what has been your passion? And lastly, if for some reason the ability to play music was taken from you tomorrow, what would you want to do with your remaining days?

MOSS: I could never decide what exactly I wanted to do with my life growing up. All I knew is I had to be in a creative career. I struggled in school and never graduated high school. The message I received from the world was that I didn’t have many options. So I always imagined myself as an artist, whether that be a hobby or a job. For a long time, music felt like a club I just didn’t get invited into, something I’d only consume — never participate. Every day I’m surprised and endlessly grateful to play music at all! If I wasn’t able to play music, I’d like to pursue fashion design, work in illustration, or become a makeup artist.

Was there a specific show or band you saw that made you want to start playing music or say, “Damn, I need to be up on a stage doing that”?

MOSS: I apologize for how cliche this is going to sound, but My Chemical Romance was that band for me! Scenes from the Life On The Murder Scene documentary feel burned into my brain. It left a huge impression on me and led me inevitably down the line of punk and hardcore bands. I discovered Black Flag, Dead Kennedys, [and] Negative Approach and modern bands like Ceremony, Power Trip, [and] Incendiary. I consumed everything I could: books, zines, documentaries, even defunct internet forums. I wanted to jump in a van with a bunch of my friends, scream, sweat, and dance in random basements or VFW halls. I went to countless concerts and Warped Tours, but DIY shows were the most inspiring to me. Any band could get up there and do it! That was huge for me. I didn’t have to be technically good or talented because that wasn’t the point of punk music. 

Growing up in New Jersey, the shadow of the Misfits loomed large, as did the NYHC scene, but then at some point so did The Sopranos and Jersey Shore. So people would hear where my band was from and expect these caricatures of the things they heard about on TV. Admittedly, when I hear Santa Cruz, my brain immediately goes to skateboards and Lost Boys. But I’m sure there’s so much more… What do you wish people knew about where you’re from, cutting your teeth in the Santa Cruz scene, and what are things you would like to stop seeing in article titles or props in proposed photo shoots?

MOSS: I love the fact that you brought this up! I’m not even from Santa Cruz, and while I’ll wave the flag proudly, I won’t deny being a transplant in this city. I love the sunny beach, surfing, and boardwalks, but I don’t feel it connects much to my identity or Scowl’s identity. Sometimes I grow tired of go-go boots and daisies. I just try to see it as an opportunity to try something new. It’s a fickle thing to want to be identifiable yet feel strangled by the idea of being boxed into one singular identity! 

MALACHI GREENE: It’s tough to say because I love all those things! I don’t mind them being staples for the town. I grew up skating and surfing, and it’s for sure a huge part of the town. I wish more people knew Killer Klowns from Outer Space was filmed here. I wish more people knew the struggles of Santa Cruz and the rising houseless population due to the wage gap, rent increases, and lack of mental health support for those in need. It’s painted as a sunny town with a beach and boardwalk, but there’s struggles for those who live here that get overlooked often. So many people here are forced out because of how hard it is to make ends meet. Plus, so many people buy up homes for vacation, and there’s already a lack of affordable housing. I love Santa Cruz, and it’s a beautiful place, but a lot gets brushed under the rug that shouldn’t, and there should be more support for the houseless and those struggling with mental health.

I imagine your band gets asked a lot about what your feelings are or what you feel your role is in female-fronted hardcore or with femininity being represented in the genre. I know there is a lot to be done and said before equality is actually achieved in all aspects, but I wonder if you are getting tired of answering those types of questions and wish you could just be seen as a band first. Or do you feel like the surface has not yet been scratched and it is partly your duty to continue the conversation? 

MOSS: I think two things can be true. I do find it tiring when it’s the only thing a stranger can speak to me about, but that exhaustion doesn’t mean I want to silence the conversation altogether. When Scowl started, I wanted to write lyrics about my experience, but not pigeonhole myself! It was scary at first to walk that tightrope. I feel it’s all of our personal duty to question the way we think and perceive these invisible structures, whether that be having the conversation or finding resources to educate ourselves, and I’m not afraid to help get the engine started on that. Lastly and most personally, I want to be perceived as a musician before “a girl in a band.”

I feel I might be a bit older than everyone in your band, and without trying to sound like the guy who had to walk through two miles of snow uphill in both directions to see his favorite band play… I do remember vividly that back in the day when a band decided to grow, evolve, and change up their style, the loud shrieks of “SELLOUT!” would be hurled from the lips of everyone in the room.

However, these days it seems to be much more embraced by the fans. With bands like Title Fight (as I’ve heard you mention in past interviews as an influence or at least being a fan of) taking fans on a lighter journey into more melodic and shoegaze-type feels, do you find it to be an easier road incorporating more melodic singing into the band’s sound? And Kat, do you find it to be a bit more liberating to now have a different style of singing that you can incorporate into your repertoire as a musician and songwriter?

MOSS: The scene has definitely become a bit more open-minded and welcoming to bands trying new things, new styles. It still results in a sort of chatter, but nothing compared to the stories I’ve read about! Thank god. 

I find it to be extremely liberating to try new things vocally and melodically! I’m still finding my voice, and there would be no joy in playing in a band if I denied myself the opportunity to experiment and be inspired by other genres and writing styles. All of my favorite artists challenge themselves, and I admire that about them. 

GREENE: People will always speculate on what selling out is, but we’ve always been true to ourselves and done what we’ve liked to do. I’m sure people say we have sold out for adding more melody! Bands have been adding melody and experimenting with genre since the start. Bad Brains, Hüsker Dü, 7 Seconds, Biohazard, and many more have done genre-bending songs or albums way before us. We’ve grown as musicians, and we’re able to add other influences because we learned to play a little better. If we didn’t evolve, it’d be stale. I think people are more open-minded now, and I think that’s because of bands before us, like the ones listed before, and more current bands like Ceremony, Code Orange, Title Fight, Turnstile, Trash Talk, Angel Du$t, and more who broke the mold and did shit their way. I love the creativity going on these days.

Growing up, there were certain labels that my friends and I became fans of as if they were bands. The quality control was so good, and the community they cultivated was so refined that it ensured whenever a new record was released or a new band was signed, you could almost guarantee it would be something that you could get behind and would dig. These days with labels like Triple B, Closed Casket, and your current home, a label like Flatspot, I was wondering if you felt like you were a part of something similar or reminiscent of that? 

MOSS: Something I love about hardcore is that I can rely on word of mouth or a DIY label to show me the way! I absolutely feel like the torch has been passed down with this unspoken tradition. Our subculture is sacred to us; I hope that feeling close to bands and the people playing the music never dies because you don’t get that with many other scenes. Creating those bonds is such a specific thing that makes it feel different and special, sheltered away from mass consumption or the challenges of the music industry. 

With what seems like such a fast and constant rise for your band, what are your favorite goals you have accomplished with Scowl? Are there any that still remain? Do you have a plan in place to achieve these goals? Does that somehow involve an endgame or an ending to the band?

GREENE: Honestly, my only goal was to play shows with my friends when we started. I wanted to tour and see new places. As we did that, things started happening, and cool opportunities arose that we couldn’t believe were happening! Playing Sound and Fury, to me, seemed like the biggest thing in the world, and I cherish that memory dearly. Playing MSG on the Limp Bizkit tour was something I never thought would happen, and I am still coming to terms with the fact that we got to play there. Even meeting some of my favorite bands on the road or [at] fests we’ve played together. I want to tour much more and continue to grow as a musician and as a band.

I have a lot of goals now, but in the start, I was just learning how to play guitar and perform. There are a lot of bands I’d love to tour with and places we haven’t played yet. The plan is to keep working at it until we get there. No end game planned for the band, and to be honest, I hope it never ends. For the first time in my life, I feel happy and part of something positive. I hope to keep that going for as long as possible.

MOSS: Certain things have happened scarily fast in Scowl’s world! I’m really happy we got to play Sound and Fury in 2022. That’s a huge personal milestone… Playing Coachella was also stupidly insane. Touring overseas, support tours with some of my favorite bands, writing an LP, even quitting my job to tour full time all fall on the list of favorite accomplishments. I’m a very goal-oriented person, so as I’ve checked off boxes, I’ve added more, touring Japan being at the top of the list, writing and recording LP 2, and to always do things that would make my younger self proud. 13-year-old Kat would not believe being on the cover of AP or being in a band for that matter!

I don’t see an end in sight, and because we never exclusively had a plan, I’m just enjoying the ride and finding beauty in every part of the experience, even the tough stuff like pressure and vulnerability. I want to do this as long as it makes me happy. At the end of the day, it’s about always finding gratitude.